Members List
Who's Online

Welcome Guest to The Blue Lodge an on-line community for Freemasons and interested non-Freemasons.

The Blue Lodge is a community portal for discussing the ancient art of Freemasonry and it's future. If you are a Antient or Moderns Freemason, Knights Templar, Scottish Rite, York Rite, Shriner, Eastern Star, Prince Hall Mason or just read Dan Brown's book "The Da Vinci Code" and want to learn more about the "true" art of Freemasonry, then this is the right place for you.

You are currently viewing our community portal as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions, articles and access our other FREE features. By registering as a member you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload your own photos and access many other special features.


Click Here to Register for your FREE Account!

Go Back   The Blue Lodge > Blue Lodge Forums > Masonic Dotage


  No Account? Register Now!
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes

EA Lesson
Old 07-22-2006, 10:07 AM   #1
D. W. Brown
TBL Staff
 
D. W. Brown's Avatar
 
D. W. Brown is Online
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 652
Rep: D. W. Brown is a name known to allD. W. Brown is a name known to allD. W. Brown is a name known to allD. W. Brown is a name known to allD. W. Brown is a name known to allD. W. Brown is a name known to all
Rep Power: 10
Send a message via ICQ to D. W. Brown Send a message via Skype™ to D. W. Brown
EA Lesson

Two weeks ago at one of my lodges regular meetings there was a brother turning in his EA lesson so he could advance to his FC degree.

When he got up and started his lesson, I knew he was in trouble right away. His examiner had to prompt him every 3 or 4 words, I kid you not, every 3 or 4 words he would have to be prompted. Then he still would get some wrong and the examiner would just keep going. It was the worst lesson I have EVER seen.

Please don't misunderstand here I'm serious when I saw every 3 to 4 words he was prompted and would STILL get it wrong. Lets just be clear there....

Well it was time to vote to accept or reject his lesson and out of about 15 to 20 masons present, I was the ONLY one that said NO.

After we walked out of the lodge room a couple started bitching at me for voting No. One said "He has dislexia" I explained to that brother that is a reading issue not a memorization issue. Then another said "I've seen much worse" and I explained grading was not based on the Bell Curve system.

One brother told me he was proud of me for answering No and he said nothing like that would have happened at his lodge. Time to find a new lodge I guess.
__________________
Dale Brown, 3°
TBL Staff
__________________

Must Reads for Every Mason:

A Peculiar System of Morality | Laudable Pursuit | The Ancient Landmarks
The Truth About the Antients and the Moderns | It's About Time

__________________

Must Visit Links for Masons:

Grand Orient de France | Grand Orient of the United States of America
The Burning Taper | Halcyon Lodge | The Philalethes Society
  Reply With Quote

Old 07-23-2006, 10:37 AM   #2
David Herman
Super Moderator
 
David Herman's Avatar
 
David Herman is Offline
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 271
Rep: David Herman is on a distinguished road
Rep Power: 3
It's a complicated issue, but in the end, your vote is your vote, and you should let your conscience be your guide.

I have seen men who made great masons, who show up at almost every meeting, who are among the friendliest and helpful in the lodge, who were just bad at rote memorization; I have also seen men who stood their 3rd degree proficiency (about 30 mins for us) the very next meeting, with barely an error, who have not returned to lodge or replied to contact attempts for years.

The guide that we usually use is the coach; first, he should not propose the candidate for proficiency ballot unless:

1) The candidate is proficient (need not be perfect); or

2) The candidate, despite months of work, is as proficient as he will ever get.

Even then, it is up to the individual votes of the brethren present. In Georgia, it is unmasonic to reveal how you intend to vote or how you voted, or to ask another brother how he intends to vote or how he voted.
__________________
http://morelight.org
  Reply With Quote

Old 08-07-2006, 02:18 PM   #3
LarryW
Junior Member
 
LarryW is Offline
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 10
Rep: LarryW is on a distinguished road
Rep Power: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Herman
In Georgia, it is unmasonic to reveal how you intend to vote or how you voted, or to ask another brother how he intends to vote or how he voted.
There are two kinds of voting in Oregon: Secret voting is done with the ballot box or during elections, and your statement would hold true; open voting is done with the voting sign for motions and similar business matters. I have not witnessed a questionable proficiency yet, and we have never voted on one. I'm sure the procedure is documented in our Constitutions or By-Laws, but they're just out of reach (by about 25 miles) to confirm.
  Reply With Quote

Old 08-07-2006, 11:59 PM   #4
D. W. Brown
TBL Staff
 
D. W. Brown's Avatar
 
D. W. Brown is Online
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 652
Rep: D. W. Brown is a name known to allD. W. Brown is a name known to allD. W. Brown is a name known to allD. W. Brown is a name known to allD. W. Brown is a name known to allD. W. Brown is a name known to all
Rep Power: 10
Send a message via ICQ to D. W. Brown Send a message via Skype™ to D. W. Brown
Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryW
There are two kinds of voting in Oregon: Secret voting is done with the ballot box or during elections, and your statement would hold true; open voting is done with the voting sign for motions and similar business matters. I have not witnessed a questionable proficiency yet, and we have never voted on one. I'm sure the procedure is documented in our Constitutions or By-Laws, but they're just out of reach (by about 25 miles) to confirm.

I am new, so if I mis-stepped and made a mistake by revealing the way I voted I apologize and will remember that from now on. I assumed since the vote was done in the open ( in lodge) and not by secret ballot, I could talk about it.

Please don't get me wrong, I feel for the brother who had trouble with his lesson and do not mean to sound like I am putting him down. Please enlighten me to the proper rules of acceptance of a lesson and the "traditional" criteria for being accepted as a freemason and passed to Master Mason.?
__________________
Dale Brown, 3°
TBL Staff
__________________

Must Reads for Every Mason:

A Peculiar System of Morality | Laudable Pursuit | The Ancient Landmarks
The Truth About the Antients and the Moderns | It's About Time

__________________

Must Visit Links for Masons:

Grand Orient de France | Grand Orient of the United States of America
The Burning Taper | Halcyon Lodge | The Philalethes Society
  Reply With Quote

Old 08-08-2006, 10:37 AM   #5
tubulcain420
Member
 
tubulcain420 is Offline
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 40
Rep: tubulcain420 is on a distinguished road
Rep Power: 0
Voting about entrance into the organization via ballot box is sacred and private. Voting on proficiency is open and all know who votes yhay and nay.. you did fine brother
  Reply With Quote

Old 08-08-2006, 02:10 PM   #6
LarryW
Junior Member
 
LarryW is Offline
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 10
Rep: LarryW is on a distinguished road
Rep Power: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by D. W. Brown
Please don't get me wrong, I feel for the brother who had trouble with his lesson and do not mean to sound like I am putting him down. Please enlighten me to the proper rules of acceptance of a lesson and the "traditional" criteria for being accepted as a freemason and passed to Master Mason.?
I think we all feel for those who have more trouble than we did in proving up. But we must also remember that when we make changes of our own accord, those changes will be passed down to future Masons. If like changes are made from one class to the next, the true ritual is as lost as the word.

Another consideration is that many, if not most, Grand Lodges have taken advantage of technology and maintain the ritual in paper or electronic form for the sole purpose of ensuring it is not lost. So, the aspiring candidate who, for whatever reason, cannot give a good proficiency, might still become a better man and Mason. And if he understands the lesson, we can help him perfect his ashlar.

As to your vote, there is only one person to whom you must answer. If you voted with your heart, then you voted correctly. Anyone who challenged your vote should spend some time adjusting their compasses and think about the EA lesson.
  Reply With Quote

Old 08-09-2006, 12:07 AM   #7
David Herman
Super Moderator
 
David Herman's Avatar
 
David Herman is Offline
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 271
Rep: David Herman is on a distinguished road
Rep Power: 3
I can't speak for other jurisdictions, obviously. In Georgia, "petitions for initiation, advancement, affiliation and dimit require unanimous secret ballot"; only the Master's proficiency may be voted openly, and lodge bylaws or Master's decree may require that to be secret ballot as well. Naturally, your open vote is observable by all present.

Excerpts from the 2005 Georgia Masonic Code (latest soft copy I have):
41-112. Secrecy. —It is exceedingly improper and un-Masonic for any brother to make any remark, reflecting upon the ballot of any other brother or the motives influencing him. The ballot is and should remain secret. No brother has the right to inquire who cast a negative ballot or why. No one has the right to say how he voted, or why, and a by-law contravening this is void...

41-116. Vote Required.—Petitions for initiation, advancement, affiliation and dimit require unanimous secret ballot...
As far as what criteria are generally used to determine proficiency... we have none. Each brother present must decide for himself if he feels the candidate should advance or not.
__________________
http://morelight.org
  Reply With Quote

Old 08-09-2006, 02:12 PM   #8
LarryW
Junior Member
 
LarryW is Offline
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 10
Rep: LarryW is on a distinguished road
Rep Power: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Herman
No one has the right to say how he voted, or why
That's interesting.
Quote:
Petitions for ... advancement
I don't think I've heard this term. I don't think Oregon has such a petition; the petition a candidate submits is for the degrees, which is to mean the three degrees.

(I really have to pull out my Constitution & By-Laws now.)
  Reply With Quote

Old 08-10-2006, 09:14 AM   #9
David Herman
Super Moderator
 
David Herman's Avatar
 
David Herman is Offline
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 271
Rep: David Herman is on a distinguished road
Rep Power: 3
Ha. Things are different all over, I guess.

Here, one petitions for the degrees (initiation). Ballot on petition for degrees based on character.

If granted, there's EA conferral, coaching, then reciting the EA catechism. He then petitions for advancement (no new form, just the Secretary asking if he wishes to advance). Ballot for advancement based on proficiency and character.

Repeat on FC.

After the MM, the brother must be voted (not balloted) upon for proficiency only - he is already a MM.
__________________
http://morelight.org

Last edited by David Herman : 09-17-2006 at 04:25 PM.
  Reply With Quote

Old 08-10-2006, 04:47 PM   #10
Tom Accuosti
Junior Member
 
Tom Accuosti is Offline
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Southington, CT - USA
Posts: 22
Rep: Tom Accuosti is on a distinguished road
Rep Power: 0
Send a message via AIM to Tom Accuosti Send a message via Yahoo to Tom Accuosti
We dont' vote on a candidate's "proficiency", as we call it; this is left up the the WM and his representative (usually the SW) who has checked out the candidate. In fact, I've only seen one proficiency in an open lodge and it surprised me. I think it's a great idea, and it gives the candidate more incentive to study.

We often check them out on the eve of - or sometimes just bere - their next degree. Normally this is not an issue in our lodge - in fact, at our last degree the SW drove the candidate down to the lodge we were visiting and checked him out in the car.
http://masonictao.blogspot.com/2006/...ry-degree.html

Last year, though, we did have an issue when a candidate had not contacted the lodge at all until the night of his MM degree - a Past Master's Degree, and the acting SW went to the prep room to check them out (we had 3) and found one young man completely clueless. He came back into lodge to report, much to the embarassment of the young man's grandfather, who came down to take a part in the degree. After some discussion, we decided to allow him to participate, but with instructions to his sponsors that he needed to make the MM proficiency before he could recieve his dues card.

I'd like to say that this had a happy ending and he's now the best ritualist and most active member. I'd like to say that, but unfortunately he became a bit huffy about being checked out and even more so when the SW explained to him the decision. AFAIK, he hasn't been back to pick up his dues card.

This is obviously a major breakdown in communication between the candidate and his sponsors. A sponsor thought that the grandfather was handling the communication, the grandfather thought somebody esle was keeping in touch, etc.
__________________
Tom Accuosti
The Tao of Masonry
  Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
The Lesson has been on me now let me die TK/RA Alt.Freemasonry 0 03-15-2005 11:31 AM
For the new guys lesson #1 Newsgroups trolls 101 Sinpac Alt.Freemasonry 3 02-02-2005 01:21 PM
THE HIGHER DEGREES HANDBOOK -o John 6:37 o- Alt.Freemasonry 0 10-25-2003 07:19 PM
America's FINAL lesson, TEACHER IS SPEAKING CHILDREN Comrade Alt.Freemasonry 8 08-10-2003 05:39 AM
America's FINAL lesson, TEACHER IS SPEAKING CHILDREN Comrade Alt.Freemasonry 0 08-10-2003 05:27 AM



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:54 PM.
  

vBulletin skin developed by: eXtremepixels
Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 2.4.0
Copyright TheBlueLodge.org 2006

Site Map (Not Shown on Registered Members Pages)
MN 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9
AF - 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, 48, 49, 50, 51, 52, 53, 54, 55, 56, 57, 58, 59, 60, 61, 62, 63, 64, 65, 66, 67, 68, 69, 70, 71, 72, 73, 74, 75, 76, 77, 78, 79, 80, 81, 82, 83, 84, 85, 86, 87, 88, 89, 90, 91, 92, 93, 94, 95, 96, 97, 98, 99, 100, 101, 102, 103, 104, 105, 106, 107, 108, 109, 110, 111, 112, 113
ST - 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6,